14 Mar 2014 16:15:54
Was just thinking about all the moaners and the injuries we've had and wondering if the equivalent players were taken out of the 91 or 78 teams, would people be calling for Cloughs head in their absence?
Now- Cohen, Lansbury, Wilson, Hobbs, Lichai, Reid, Vaughan, Djebbour, Blackstock.
91-Pearce, Keane, Walker, Chettle, Laws, Woan, Hodge, Clough, Glover
79- Clarke, McGovern, Burns, Lloyd, Anderson, Robertson, Gemmill, Francis, Withe

I can't see that we'd have reached an FA cup final or won a league with those players out!

{Ed034's Note - great post

1.) 14 Mar 2014
Good post but I don't think some of the current players are in the same league as those in the other two teams. Robbo would be iraplacable on the world scene same for Keene and Pearce never mind des walker. Francis the most expensive player in the world can't be compared with dex or déjabbour.

{Ed034's Note - I don't think anyone would argue with that, but if these players can get us promoted, we'll look back in years to come and compare the team at that time with these current guys

2.) 14 Mar 2014
Do hope so :)

3.) 14 Mar 2014
Peter Withe left for Aston Villa in the August of 78 and Trevor Francis missed the European Cup final 1980. Teams in the 70's used a squad of around 17 players, there is little comparison between the past and the current team.

In the 70's players trained in the pubs and clubs and in the late 80's early 90's Forest used match games as training.

BD over trains his players and bad luck have caused havoc. But we always run out of steam in the later stages of the season.

4.) 14 Mar 2014
It is not a great post, adding to my above comments, this is a different era. Burnley would struggle if they had the injuries we have had, but Forest and QPR have big squads.

Injuries have had significant impact in the last few weeks, but this deflects from the real issue and that is the inconsistent teams selection, poor tactic and negative team formation.

{Ed034's Note - it's a great posts because it's different and h&s a good lint to it. You could do it another way and take out the whole back four of man city, along with there best three midfielders and a striker. How would they cope??
Your last paragraph is a little strange. We are missing different players every week, so how on earth are you expected to be consistent with selection?? 4231 is not negative, how can a team playing with three attacking players behind a forward, with both full backs bombing forward be negative??
No squad could cope with what we have had.

5.) 14 Mar 2014
You did not add my post about Cologne April 1979, Forest had five players injured, that was nearly a third of that squad. Forest put out a patch work team and believe it or not we had no recognised left back. There are two differences between then and now, firstly a great manager and secondly the desire of the team. The pitch was a mud bath and Forest came back from two nil down to lead 3-2 only to concede in the later part of the game.

On the Man City perspective, Man City could field to top teams, we can only field one. Granted that our team is light of seven first team players, but it is missed chances that has cost us. During the pre-injury crisis we dropped points and in the injury crisis we dropped points because we are not clinical in front of goal. Had we been more clinical in front of goal we would have been out of reach just like Leicester. Missed opportunity to get out of this league, next season will be even harder.

{Ed034's Note - if you took out those players from the man city 11, do you think they'd be challenging as they are for the title?? I don't.

6.) 14 Mar 2014
Henderson and Cox have been fit and yet he still played Halford upfront. We didn't have injuries yet he still changed personnel.

BD was making a point about the lack of quality we had up front?

{Ed034's Note - halford was played up front for one fans and went on to score in several matches, playing a key role. Due to this he kept his place

7.) 14 Mar 2014
Full backs bombing forward, is not negative the last time a full back was bombing forward was Cohen versus Burnley at home. We are over cautious at home and negative away.

My opinion, fourteen draws back my argument, or is the lack of clinical finishing doesn't matter either way we are not good enough injuries or not and them manager is good enough. It is PO this season and PO next season if we don't go up this. We have a chance in the PO, but we will not go up auto next season if we fail in the PO.

{Ed034's Note - you cannot say fox has not been doing this.
You do not know who's gone up, who's come down, what our squad, so that's some mystic meg prediction you've got going on.
The biggest difference next season to this would be we have a good basis of a squad and have a squad that both know each other and are settled. The amount if new signings has made it difficult to get a pattern of plsy going and we had just started to do this when injuries hit.

8.) 14 Mar 2014
Your response to my last post, does hint that we may well be in this league next season. I am not negative, I just feel that we have not been positive enough this season and that clinical finishing has been our downfall and not the injuries.

We have had bad luck this season, but it doesn't help with this siege mentality and the not bothered whether people like me or not, is an unwanted distraction.

{Ed034's Note - I said at the start of the season that promotion this would be a bonus and I expect it next

9.) 15 Mar 2014
Which is an admission that you do not think we will go up in the PO or not even make it. We do have a chance in the PO and Wigan have 14 games in 7 weeks which could effect there PO push and form going into the PO.

Next season, if we make PO and don't go up, is automatic. My only worry is the expectation will be greater?

{Ed003's Note - the season always starts with delusional optimists it is usual around this time of year attitudes change and realism kicks in, I reckon you'll make the play offs.}

10.) 15 Mar 2014
Are you the third party that takes over when there is conflict on this site, hence the word "you will".

My club, Forest, may well make the PO and could well get promoted via the PO. But we have spent a lot of money, again, yet still never really cut the mustard. ,

{Ed003's Note - Of course by my words I'm not a forest fan but I'm not a fan of a rival either so don't even think of going down that route, I've been editing posts on forest for a number of years now and if you could register that would be great as the site is going registered only posters soon to cut out the complete shite that gets through.}

11.) 15 Mar 2014
I posted the original comment. Sorry of you thought it wasn't a good post! My point was that even though the players now can't be directly compared to those of the past- I was taking out the players in the equivalent position to show how it could have changed our history. I used Withe because he left early that season similarly to Blackstock- and Francis because he had come in with a reputation (like Djebbour ) and was yet to prove himself with 'that goal' in the European cup. Who knows- if the 77/78 team had suffered bad luck with injuries then would it not be reasonable to assume we would at least be a couple of points worse of over that season? If so, there would have been no League title and no European cup qualification and glory. We may still have won the league cups in that period but without the league and European cups would we still be calling all the members of that team 'legends' or would we simply remember them as the good promising team that finished 2nd or 3rd but had bad luck with injuries?
One thing is for sure- we have had really bad luck this year. I do hope it isn't bad training methods etc by Billy and if just bad luck then things may even out in the long run.
Regarding the comparison with Keane- well, at the time Keane came through he was unproven on the big stage ( as is Lansbury) but he went on to great things with Utd. Who knows how many of our current promising players may go on to have great careers or who will fade whether it be with us or other teams. we all know the potential of some of our squad. I Just hope they make it and it's with us then all this discussion will be irrelevant when we are one of the best teams again. (for however long it can last)
You surely can't say that we didn't look good until Wilson and then others started getting injuries this season. Hopefully we can find our form again. I, as much as anybody, am really disappointed with many of our results even when we had a full strength team. A lot of draws may have cost us, but I am 100% behind all at our club through the ups and downs.
I don't agree with a lot of the negative posts but you are all fellow Forest fans and I would stand next to you and sing along all day long if I could.
Keep the faith. COYR
Great work Ed. Always good reasoned responses.

12.) 15 Mar 2014
Tbe ppster has made some valid points ed. I personally agree that players are over trained. At mid season players should be fit enough to just do light training between matches. What is it wi the h all the pre match warm ups and warm downs. Pearce never came out until kick off lol. An experiment was done a few years back where one athlete did no warming up and the other did the full monty including stretches erc. There was no diff in performance or injury history. Food for thought. I still am bemused by what bd calls conditioning. Players should be conditioned after a few matches.
Rutland red

{Ed034's Note - it's a phrase used by many managers and clubs. I would call conditioning to mean being fit enough to play Saturday, Tuesday, Saturday without any problems either physically or performance wise

13.) 15 Mar 2014
Forest, with the money spent, have no excuse for the shocking form of late. the side we put out vs barnsley should have got us 3 points. the side we put out would make the starting 11 of most other teams in the division. 2-3 games a week? I used to play football tornaments where we would play 3-4 90 minuit games in a day when I was a lad, and we all had the energy to play the games with 15 players and no injuries. not at the park with my mates either, for belper town u16s.
too many excuses i'm afraid

{Ed034's Note - haha well if you used to do it when you were a kid and if belper u16s so it

14.) 15 Mar 2014
Can't really argue with the op it puts our injury crisis into perspective. It doesn't matter how much the other players cost because we are missing the key players that really matter. Radi never has been or never will be a direct replacement for Lansbury, Collins never will be a like for like replacement for Hobbs, halford will never be a right back. Etc